Courts & Litigation Criminal Justice & the Rule of Law Democracy & Elections

The Lawfare Podcast: Does It Matter Whether Trump Believed His Own Lies?

Natalie K. Orpett, Benjamin Wittes, Saraphin Dhanani, Roger Parloff
Monday, August 21, 2023, 8:00 AM
It’s only been a few weeks since Donald Trump was indicted, but both he and his lawyers have already been previewing their defense.
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It’s only been a few weeks since Special Counsel Jack Smith indicted Donald Trump. But both he and his lawyers have already been previewing their case in defense: that he was protected by the First Amendment, that he relied on the advice of counsel, and—the glue holding it all together—he really believed what he was saying. 

We recently published two articles on the subject. The first, by Lawfare Editor-in-Chief Benjamin Wittes and Legal Fellow Saraphin Dhanani, assesses Trump’s likely defenses. The second, by Lawfare Senior Editor Roger Parloff, argues that a jury may well see through them. Lawfare Executive Editor Natalie Orpett sat down with Ben, Saraphin, and Roger to talk through it all.

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Courts & Litigation Criminal Justice & the Rule of Law Democracy & Elections
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Natalie K. Orpett

Natalie K. Orpett

@nkorpett
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Natalie Orpett is the executive editor of Lawfare and deputy general counsel of the Lawfare Institute. She was previously an attorney at the law firm Jenner & Block, where she focused on investigations and government controversies, and also maintained an active pro bono practice. She served as civilian counsel to a defendant in the Guantanamo Military Commissions for more than eight years.
Benjamin Wittes

Benjamin Wittes

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Benjamin Wittes is editor in chief of Lawfare and a Senior Fellow in Governance Studies at the Brookings Institution. He is the author of several books.
Saraphin Dhanani

Saraphin Dhanani

SaraphinD
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Saraphin Dhanani is the Legal Fellow at the Lawfare Institute. She previously worked at the Estonian Ministry of Foreign Affairs for the Ambassador for Human Rights and in the Markets Group at the Federal Reserve Bank of New York. She holds a B.A. from Wellesley College, where she was a Fellow and Ambassador at the Madeleine Korbel Albright Institute, and a J.D. from Stanford Law School, where she was the Senior Articles Editor of the Stanford Law Review.
Roger Parloff

Roger Parloff

@rparloff
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Roger Parloff is a journalist based in Washington, D.C. For 12 years, he was the main legal correspondent at Fortune Magazine. His work has also been published in ProPublica, The New York Times, New York, NewYorker.com, Yahoo Finance, Air Mail, IEEE Spectrum, Inside, Legal Affairs, Brill’s Content, and others. An attorney who no longer practices, he is the author of "Triple Jeopardy," a book about an Arizona death penalty case. He is a senior editor at Lawfare.

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